EVIL EDITOR

Why you don't get published.

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Name: Evil Editor
Location: United States

Friday, March 21, 2008

Q & A 140 WTF?


I have a 'nasty' word in the first few pages of my novel, and it's a nasty word that's repeated a few times. No, the word isn't fuck. I've looked at this and thought a lot about it in the past few days, and I thought about reworking it, but it belongs there. It's actually central to the setup of the plot. And I repeat, no, the word isn't fuck, and the word isn't a synonym for fuck. Is this a deal-killer when an agent reads?


Just to give me an idea of how hard you tried to get rid of the word, did you feel it was central to the setup of your question to use the word "fuck" several times?

Does your word come up as often per paragraph in your book as "fuck" does in your question?

Let's see, it's not a synonym for "fuck," so it can't be "poling the gondola to Love Canal."

Does your word have 4 letters, 10 letters, or twelve letters?

Which of the following is it a synonym for? Dropping the kids off at the pool, love oasis, pork sword, Republican.

If your word is central to your plot, does that mean you can't avoid using it in your query letter? If so, always double check to be sure you didn't accidentally use it in the salutation. (I know that's unlikely, but you throw these words around so willy-nilly I thought it best to warn you.) Wait a minute, is your word "willy"?

It doesn't sound like you'll be submitting this to agents who handle only inspirational novels, so I think we can assume the agent won't be offended by the word itself. She's probably seen it before, in emails from authors she declined to represent. She may, however, be offended by the context in which you use it. For example, compare these two excerpts (I've replaced the unknown word with a series of random letters and symbols):

1. "You've raped me and tortured me for three months, you depraved bastard," she said. "Any last words before I put a bullet in your head?"

"Yeah. Go to hell, c#@t."


2. It was a sunny day in Pleasantville, and Father O'Leary was heading for the church to hear confessions. As he crossed the street he saw two c#@ts coming out of the ice cream parlor.


Note than in example 1, a very bad person is using the kind of language one might expect from a very bad person who's about to get what's coming to him. In example 2, such language is unlikely if this is the good Father's POV, so this must be the author's POV. This might bother the agent.

If your agent suggests that example 1 would be less offensive and equally effective with your word replaced by "you old cow," well, that's what you're paying her 15% for.

Finally, to avoid repetition, you might want to consider whether to change the c word to the b word occasionally, or whether to change the m word to the other b word, or even f-ing b-word. Better yet, make him British and have him use a British insult that Americans wouldn't find offensive:

"Any last words before I put a bullet in your head?"

"Yeah. Go to hell, wankcheese."

41 Comments:

Blogger blogless_troll said...

I can't believe you wrote wankcheese. Now I feel dirty.

10:01 AM  
Blogger fairyhedgehog said...

Evil Editor: change the c word to the b word occasionally, or [...] change the m word to the other b word, or even f-ing b-word.

So, "cow" becomes "bitch" and "moron" becomes "bugger", or even "flaming bugger"? I'm not sure I've got my language right here but then I am British. And as you've noticed, we have all the best swear words.

10:04 AM  
Blogger Robin S. said...

Wow. I had to look up wankcheese. And guess where I found it?

In your favorite place:
The Urban Dictionary website.

(Hey Gina, EE had a definition on there. No kidding. For 'tasty'.)

10:10 AM  
Blogger Whirlochre said...

Wankcheese?

Lucky it's Good Friday or I'd have rushed out and had a tattoo done...

10:13 AM  
Blogger Dave F. said...

I thought wankcheese was vegemite?

Several cable channels make a living out of removing the "nasty" words from movies and showing them. Sometimes it works. The Usual Suspects doesn't need cursing to work. Sometimes it doesn't. Goodfellas sounds stupid. (and Goodfellas is filled with truly vulgar speechifying).

An interesting side note to all of this.
When the Australian film MAD MAX (1979) appeared, it was considered so violent in its depiction of revenge that it received an automatic R rating.
The second movie in the trilogy - ROAD WARRIOR (1981) - was the one with the bizarre clothing and strange vehicle chases and all sorts of gory death. It was new and considered "avant garde" for its time. It received an R.
When Mel Gibson did the third movie of the series BEYOND THUNDERDOME (1985), the car chase scenes were considered tame. Even the amazing line "two men enter, one man leaves." and "Dying time is here!" didn't move the ratings board. The original script received a PG13 which the producers considered the Kiss of Death. So they wrote a tiny scene in the movie where the one kid says "fuck" and it received an R rating for that word alone.
In the few short years, public sentiment changed about the level of violence suitable for children to see.

The point being -- set up the story, set up the character -- and if the vulgarity is true to the character and story, it won't matter to the reader.

10:43 AM  
Blogger fairyhedgehog said...

'Wankcheese' has only one definition in the Urban Dictionary, and that's an unpopular one. It's not the UK's favourite swear word. (I thought EE had made it up.)

Robin: I looked up 'tasty' and sure enough, there is EE.

10:48 AM  
Blogger Wes said...

*&^%!!!!!!

The @#$& company filter blocked access to The Urban Dictionary. I still don't know WTF wankcheese means!!!

A year ago I would not have thought Republican was a dirty word, but since they have hosed up the country, I agree it is filthy. I'll cast my vote this year for ex-Governor Sptizer's escort, Kristen. At least she made the most of her assets.

10:50 AM  
Blogger December/Stacia said...

Am I the only one who is instantly fascinated by Father O'Leary? If those are the sorts of thoughts he has, I want to read more about him. Or write it. That totally gives me an idea...

11:17 AM  
Blogger pjd said...

I'm with you, December.

But isn't everyone missing the most important bit here?

Does your word have 4 letters, 10 letters, or twelve letters?

I have always been told that we should spell out single digit numbers but that larger numbers may be written in numerals. Thus, shouldn't this be Does your word have four letters, ten letters, or 12 letters?

Oh, and I would buy the second book of Q&A just because of this answer. A good laugh on a very tough day.

11:24 AM  
Blogger Robin S. said...

My word has eight letters.

And, by the way, I don't look like the little old lady from freakin' Pasadena, like your photo. Hmmmph.

So, anyway, are you saying you think it's fine to use a bad word (that I happen to think is a good word) if it works, in context?

No nuns or other boring people will be queried. Your guess was correct on that.

12:16 PM  
Blogger Evil Editor said...

Oh, that was your question?

Yes, it's okay. Especially if it has eight letters, since that narrows it down to buttocks, dickhead and nobjuice.

12:43 PM  
Blogger blogless_troll said...

And nobjuice is often served with wankcheese.

1:16 PM  
Blogger Sarah said...

You forgot about weredink.

2:13 PM  
Blogger Whirlochre said...

Buttocks, Dickhead and Nobjuice?

Didn't they have a hit in the early 70s?

2:21 PM  
Blogger ChristineEldin said...

HAHAHAHAA! BT, I feel hungry!
This is a riot. I'll cut and paste this one for moments when I need comic relief. Or when I want to use wankcheese in a sentence.

2:23 PM  
Blogger ChristineEldin said...

Oh, I know Robin's word.
It goes to the highest bidder....

2:26 PM  
Blogger Wes said...

I'm a slow learner, but I'm beginning to catch on and expand my vocabulary.

2:28 PM  
Blogger Robin S. said...

Heh. Yeah. Chris knows it. It ain't on the nobby list.

3:21 PM  
Blogger BuffySquirrel said...

Wankcheese? That is gross!

If you're too scared to use the word in your question to EE, that suggests to me that you don't have the chutzpah to use it in your novel. In which case you should probably replace it with something you can bring yourself to share.

4:09 PM  
Blogger Scott from Oregon said...

wankcheese reminds me of "banana cream", which, for those of you who don't know everything yet, is what foams up when an inmate smuggles a bit of banana into his cell to wank with.

wankcheese was originally the stuff hidden in a corner of a cell that used to be smuggled butter...

I suppose the name has gravitated laterally over time...

4:58 PM  
Blogger Wes said...

This blog cracks me up. How could I get thru my day without it?

5:36 PM  
Blogger Dave F. said...

Soupy Sales (one of the first kiddie show hosts) once told the kids to get their Momies and Daddies to help them make their banana's cream after the commercial. He returned with pies and ice cream.

That got him in hot water. The one that got him in real trouble was to tell kids to go into their Daddies wallets and send him $1 bills.

Ah for the days of lambchop, Rodney, Knish, Hank Stohl and the gang.

7:12 PM  
Blogger Robin S. said...

Hey buff-
No - honestly- it's not about guts, honey.

It's that I wanna hold it close to the vest, until my manuscript is submitted, which will now be soon.

With my mouth, can you imagine me having a problem with nasty?

Nah...I can't either.

7:56 PM  
Anonymous iago said...

It's an adverb, isn't it? You've used an adverb in your manuscript. And I bet it's modifying a dialogue tag.

11:06 PM  
Blogger pacatrue said...

I'm betting on "grunties."

3:25 AM  
Blogger Xenith said...

I did not need to spend the rest of the night going over all the naughty words I know and counting how long they are. Bah.

It is interesting consider though, how often Americans are offended by the mildest terms but actual offensive terms are overlooked or even used often :)

(Squirrel, dear, some of us are more polite than our characters, at least on blogs.)

(Now I've screwed up my sister's auto-log-in to her gmail account, bugger.)

4:43 AM  
Blogger talpianna said...

An ADVERB??? I guess we'll have to kill her, then...

5:09 AM  
Blogger Robin S. said...

No way, guys. It's an adjective.

"Hmmmph, you all," she frustratedly fussed.

8:24 AM  
Anonymous iago said...

Damn, I was close. I'd figured it was:

"I'm really sorry; I'm usually... You must be just too hot," he told her, spunkily.

9:16 AM  
Blogger Dave F. said...

If you go to a website called "Outsports.com" about gay athletes (warning, it is GAY and might be NSW). about halfway or so down the right side under "popular atricles" there is a link to "Words you can't put on a jersey."
There are several hundred words that the NFL shop will not print on NFL authorized jerseys.

It's a long list... a very long list of inventive vulgarity.

10:29 AM  
Blogger fairyhedgehog said...

They're a bit over-zealous, aren't they? They include 'crap' and even 'dome' in their list. That stops us Brits from having a shirt that says "The Millennium Dome was crap".

You can't have 'damn', you can't have 'fairy'. You can't have 'boobs'. A friend of mine once had a t-shirt that read 'cover your boobs with snowpake' (it's a typing correction fluid, in the days when that was needed). I thought it was funny at the time.

Once you start having a list of proscribed terms it gets silly.

11:46 AM  
Blogger Robin S. said...

Hey Gina,

That's Americans for ya - they're all about a weird combination of liberty liberty liberty combined with a rod-up-your-ass political correctness-ness mixed along in there with a hefty dose of prurience that would make a mighty pile of Puritans proud.

It just gets me all tingly, beng here right in the middle of it all!

12:00 PM  
Blogger Robin S. said...

What's NSW?

12:01 PM  
Blogger fairyhedgehog said...

Is NSW the same as NSFW i.e. Not Safe For Work?

12:21 PM  
Blogger Evil Editor said...

New South Wales

12:29 PM  
Blogger Robin S. said...

Yep. I bet that's it, Daddy. New South Wales!

Anyway, I did't know there was an acronym about something not being safe for work. Guess I should've known, huh?

12:38 PM  
Blogger Sarah Laurenson said...

And here I thought I was the only one who read it as New South Wales.

2:20 PM  
Blogger Whirlochre said...

Need Some Wankcheese...

6:12 PM  
Blogger BuffySquirrel said...

The Puritans were puritanical about religion, not swear words. Or sex, for that matter.

Seriously, this word is so SIKKRIT and SPESHUL, it can't be shared with we humble minions? Awwww!

8:54 PM  
Blogger ChristineEldin said...

AHHAHAAHAHAHAHA! at "Need Some Wankcheese." Good one!

9:04 AM  
Blogger ChristineEldin said...

Buffy, I'm speshal. That's why I'm the only minion entrusted with that word.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHA!

12:32 PM  

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